back again.

[moogie]

any suggestions or lines i can use on charlie for her to start following instructions.  I just want her to understand and follow some rules and for her to know its important.

[kokonutmama]

One day my brother and his fiance came over to pick up Kody to babysit for a few hours so I could get work done.  He was still naked when they got there and I was having a hell of a time getting him to cooperated with the pantsification.  Danielle (the stbsil) said, "Hi Kody!  You're putting your pants on?  Show me how you do that!"  And he did.  Danielle rocks my world sometimes, she's a first grade teacher.

In a similar case, my grandmother (we call her Babci) came over to play with Kody outside while I did computer stuff.  He didn't have his socks on and again, was putting up a real fight about it.  Babci said, "Oh, look at these nice socks!  Are these Babci's socks?  Do these go on Babci's nose?"  She put the sock on her nose.  Kody cracked up, grabbed the socks, and put them on this feet.

Personally, I guess I'm a bit harsher than those two.  I tell Kody how something is to be done and he either does it properly or doesn't get to do it.  Granted, I do that with things like using scizzors, learning the names of the tools in mommy's tool box, nursing without kicking and pinching, or getting an up-close look at somthing in a store.  1) This is how you hold the scizzors 2) do you remember how to hold the scozzors correctly? 3) This is how you need to hold the scizzors or we'll have to try again later 4) if you hold the scizzors correctly you may use them, otherwise we'll put them away until later, do you understand? (actually I say "capice?")  5) well, we'll try again later (and the scizzors go out of reach).  He cries, but not for long, and we do try again the next day or whatever. I don't know what an expert would say about hat, but I find it satisfactory, and kody understands consequences pretty well.  and he knows how to use scizzors and doesn't kick me anymore while he's nursing.  (well, when he does he says "Down Floor! No kicking." and gets down, which is fine by me.)

[jnezmama02]

Can you give an example of instructions she's not following. I think how I would approach it changes depending on what it is. Some things are more "critical" to me, so I don't give choices and pretty much take control of the situation. But, most things, I just try to have fun w/ it or give her options of ways to accomplish them herself. For example, if I want the kids to clean up toys, I get down and do it w/ them and we sing a "clean up" song; we try to make it fun. But, if they refuse to help pick up after asking several times and it's important that it be done (people coming over or toys are in walking path), then I will physically take their hands to help pick up.  But, I very rarely get to this point, b/c honestly I let picking up toys go most of the time. 

[moogie]

well one yesterday was she had a mango and was eating it outside and i told her that she needs to eat it outside and that when she's done she can tell me and come back in(after i'd hosed her down).  well i had to go to the toilet.  when i came out she was inside with the seed which she dropped all over the floor. 

She just wont not step on everything on the floor.  she messes the place up a fair bit and will step on books.  I let her know thats not allowed but she just continues doing it even more so.  same with biting, usually while i'm feeding Asha so i can't get up, i usually call for Tristan then.  she also "misbehaves" much more when Tristan is in the room. 

Another one is the kitchen bench.  the rule is no taking things off the bench.  she just does it anyway, pulls a chair up to it or reaches up.

we've tried talking about 3 rules in the living area.
not taking things of the bench,
no standing on things
no biting

but she thinks its funny or just doesn't care to do it.

Thanks for the suggestions, i'll try to implement them.

[jnezmama02]

Megs, I'm not sure if I'm reading your statements right, but it seems to me like you might be expecting too much of her for her age. I mean, if I leave books or something on the floor or in reach, then I feel like it's fair game to be stepped on or grabbed on (at this age). Now by 3 or 4yrs, then, yea I expect them to leave something alone. Jessie I just tell one time and she leaves it alone. But, Emily, I just know that if something is w/in reach she will most likely get it.  I've left various things laying around and she's colored on them and my thought was that it was my fault for leaving it out, not that she should know not to do that (at this age). If I catch her in the act, I say "this is mommy's, you can color in your coloring book instead". But, if I'm not in the room...totally my fault.  As far as the mango, again, it's a pain but I wouldn't expect her to be able to stay outside by herself at this age. Heck, I don't leave Jessie by herself outside yet.  My suggestion there would be just to tell her you have to go to the toilet, then I'd set the mango down (in a clean container) and wrap her up in a towel or something and then just bring her w/ me.  That way she's not dripping where you don't want her to, but she's able to be w/ you.

Again, I was surprised by what you expect C to be able to do at this age. Also, I was surprised that Adrienne requires Kody to use scissors correctly already. I didn't even introduce scissors to Jessie until 3.5yrs and most of the time she doesn't hold them correctly.  Do I just baby my kids too much?

[AnnieMommy7]

Megs, I'm not sure if I'm reading your statements right, but it seems to me like you might be expecting too much of her for her age. I mean, if I leave books or something on the floor or in reach, then I feel like it's fair game to be stepped on or grabbed on (at this age). Now by 3 or 4yrs, then, yea I expect them to leave something alone. Jessie I just tell one time and she leaves it alone. But, Emily, I just know that if something is w/in reach she will most likely get it.  I've left various things laying around and she's colored on them and my thought was that it was my fault for leaving it out, not that she should know not to do that (at this age). If I catch her in the act, I say "this is mommy's, you can color in your coloring book instead". But, if I'm not in the room...totally my fault.  As far as the mango, again, it's a pain but I wouldn't expect her to be able to stay outside by herself at this age. Heck, I don't leave Jessie by herself outside yet.  My suggestion there would be just to tell her you have to go to the toilet, then I'd set the mango down (in a clean container) and wrap her up in a towel or something and then just bring her w/ me.  That way she's not dripping where you don't want her to, but she's able to be w/ you.

I agree with Hope completely here.  It seems like you're expecting way too much from Charlie for just being 2 years old.  Aidan is quite good with boundaries, ect, but we are always with him, too.  If I leave the kitchen and he dumps all of the cat food into their water, even though we've discussed it may times, I realize that that the dumping is more fun to him than remembering what I've said to him.  Also, we don't leave Aidan outside alone and if I went in without he I'd expect he follow me right on in.  I like Hopes suggestions regarding the mango.   

Again, I was surprised by what you expect C to be able to do at this age. Also, I was surprised that Adrienne requires Kody to use scissors correctly already. I didn't even introduce scissors to Jessie until 3.5yrs and most of the time she doesn't hold them correctly.  Do I just baby my kids too much?

Maybe a little?  I wouldn't and don't expect Aidan to hold scissors correctly...we haven't introduced them yet..  I will do so, however, long before 3.5 years.  All of my older kids were using scissors at home and in preschool by 3 years of age.  Will I make a bit deal of how he holds them?  Nope.  Some things should be fun and prefectionism is a disease in my book...LOL.  Life is too short, pick your battles and all of that good stuff.

Annie

[kokonutmama]

Yeah.  The reason I bought Kody his own scizzors and taught him that there's a correct way to use them ("correct" meaning holding them by the handle and only using them while sitting down.  I also insist that he only use one hand because when he tries to do it two handed his fingers get between the blades) is because we're living in a shared space and he can and does pull the rolling office chairs to the kitchen counter to get to the pencil can by the phone where my folks keep a pair of scizzors.  He also climbs up onto my mom's desk where again, there are scizzors.  He sees us using them all the time to open boxes since there are two businesses running out of the house now.  there are a lot of things he insists "Kody do, kody do!" every day that I can't let him for safety reasons, like flip pancakes, go in the medicine cabinet, etc, etc, that I wanted to show him what it was like to learn to use a tool correctly and safely and earn the right to "do."  So, he may use his scizzors in the correct way, or not at all.  He still climbs onto the counter and the desk, but doesn't go after the grown up scizzors.  We have fun cutting and gluing together, and now I feel like when I tell him he can't do something yet like stir the pot or drive the car and that someday I'll teach him the right way to do it and then he will be allowed, he has some reference. 

I guess I'm sounding defensive, which I don't like to do.  To avoid hijacking the thread, which I also don't like to do let me ramble on a little more to address the discussion at hand.

Megs, I have to say that your expectations of Charlie are higher than mine of Kody as far as self discipline, remembering rules, prioritizing Mommy says over Sounds like fun.   

[kokonutmama]

cant find the edit button, sorry... (k needed another blanket)

With what I just said being said: I am with you I think in thinking that gentle discipline still means discipline, not (here's the dirty word now...) permissiveness.  It's just that maybe I draw the line for stressing out at a different place.  I have a lot of examples very similar to Annie's cat food one.  dog food, crayons, the contents of the snack drawer, ... I took k to the post office today with his underpants on his head instead of under his pants, because I figured of the 6 articles of clothing I was asking him to put on, one out of place wouldn't be so bad.

[moogie]

thanks guys,
T and i have been talking about this recently and we have discovered that we expect too much of her. she's a toddler not a kid and we have trouble remembering that.  We've also discovered its because of our aspergers(not an excuse just a fact) .  we almost expect that she should act like an adult (its our annoying aspergic brain.  We've rented a dvd on child devellopment by the BBc, and it seems useful.  We're going to work on it and take a step back. 

thanks again.

[ShannonandDel]

Megs, I think part of it is the age they are at as well. Delaney seems SO grown up at times, with what she says and what  she (seems) to understand. I have gotten upset for some very dumb things and had to remind myself how old she is. It is ususally at the end of a long string of not listening and mess making.

Adrienne, I bought Del her own pair of safety scissors, because of a lot of the same reasons. I have scissors out a lot (yarn or wrapping paper, etc.) and it has helped a ton for her to be able to sit next to me and do the same thing with her own scissors. We haven't really worked on how to use them yet. She just pokes at things.

Isn't it great that we have each other to bounce ideas and concerns off of?

[jnezmama02]

Annie, yes, I think you're right that I'm a little too much babying. I seem to do it more w/ Jessie than Emily. I think some of it is in response to the fact that she seems already to be behind in social and physical skills. Emilly, I do let play w/ the safety scissors when Jessie is done w/ them b/c she wants to be like her big sister, but I don't try to get her to use them w/ the right hand positioning or anything yet like I do w/ Jessie.

Adrienne, sorry to get you on the defensive. Didn't mean to do that. I think your reasons make complete sense to me now that you've explained a little further. 

Megs and anyone else, I find the AAP milestone list very helpful to gauge where my kids are at.  As I've said, I know that Jessie is behind social and physical skills.  Emily seems to be right on target as of now.

Development milestones by the END of the 2nd year (basically, where are Dec kids should be right now): http://www.medem.com/MedLB/article_detaillb.cfm?article_ID=ZZZJ8RP86DC&sub_cat=105

Development milestones by the END of the 3rd year (what they should be able to do by the end of the next year, but might be hitting some milestones already):
http://www.medem.com/MedLB/article_detaillb.cfm?article_ID=ZZZ64NJ4FDC&sub_cat=105

And, just for comparison, here's Development milestones by the END of the 4th year (where they should be 2yrs from now):
http://www.medem.com/MedLB/article_detaillb.cfm?article_ID=ZZZHPR7TODC&sub_cat=105

[kokonutmama]

try not to be too sorry, Hope.  I'm glad I got to explain all that.  I'm going to look at your chart links, even though I'm a little worried.  when I get those BBC bulletins, if there's something in there that it never occured to me to look for, I start freaking out about teaching Kody.  Like it said he should be able to sing along with songs, so I've been quizing him on Twinkle Twinkle.  I know I shouldn't, it's hard to resist, though.

Yeah, Shannon, it is great we have each other.

Megs, it may be partly the Aspergers, but I think also MIL might have a tiny bit to do with it.  A dvd on child developoment sounds cool.  Once Charlie watches that, she's sure to know exactly how she's supposed to behave.  (JOKING!!  ) 

[moogie]

exactly Adrienne, she's been watching it and i'm wondering if she'll be going "no! a dog dressed as a cat is a cat, not a dog."  lol, just a segment in there does that, its funny to see how different age groups respond to different scenarios.  she likes watching it because of all the kids in it, but i actually rented it for ME!!!


yes MIL has a lot to do with it.  she's stricter and dh said she was too strict growing up too. 

[moogie]

Shannon, yeah, our 2 yr olds can do multiple things that annoy us and push us to the edge. so yeah its thatt too.

[mum2maddox]

hey megs, do you think charlie and maddox are like twins seperated at birth haha... maddox does ecxactly this stuff and while the aspergers might have something to do with it i think it is completely normal to expect a lot, i do the same i forget he is younger than he seems in so many aspects and i forget that developmentally somethings take time...

im going to have a look at those charts also but i think i might freak out a bit to at all the things i havent thought of to try haha